I was pretty excited to read Superboy #11 this week. I have been a bit surprised by this title, enjoying it more than I thought I would. I love RB Silva and Rob Lean's art. The one thing that detracted from the book was how linked it was to Teen Titans and now The Ravagers. The whole Culling storyline didn't grab me.
But all of that was behind us. Superboy #11 wasn't part of The Culling. Tom DeFalco was picking up on Scott Lobdell plots and was writing the book now. N.O.W.H.E.R.E. was demolished. And while the issue guest starred Bunker, this felt like it was going to be the first issue of a solo Superboy title. We were going to put the heavy cross-over feel to the book behind us.
Well ... if this is what this solo title is going to be like ... I don't know how much longer I am going to be reading it. This issue encapsulated everything that I think is wrong with the DCnU. Everything.
With his home a N.O.W.H.E.R.E. gone, Superboy had to figure out where he is going to live. He didn't like living with the Titans so he found a place to stay. And then he needed to fund his new life ... so what did he do ... he robbed a bank.
That's right! The 'hero' of the book robbed a bank.
And when Bunker calls him on it, saying that is what bad guys do, Superboy rebuts that 'he didn't hurt anyone' by doing this. Is that how low we have come that we have to praise our heroes for not hurting people? That white collar crimes are fine?
And this isn't him raiding N.O.W.H.E.R.E.'s funds (although we could debate the morality of that too) ... this is him stealing people's money.
Just as bad is Bunker's shrugging acceptance of these excuses. As if Superboy's reasoning isn't worth debating ... and vilifying.
So this scene alone would make me dislike this comic ... but the misses kept coming.
But look ... he notices that some people respond with hope to the S-shield. Others with fear.
Now I suppose that it is the criminals that respond with fear ... but that isn't what was said. Instead the implication is that some 'everday people' react to the Superman symbol with fear.
So in the DCnU there are people who are afraid of Superman. Superman!
It is as if DC doesn't understand who Superman is and what he represents.
To show his 'ownership' of the S-shield, Superboy gets it tattooed on his right deltoid ... albeit in a barcode manner. Ooooh ... he got a tattoo! He's gritty!
And look, the tattoo artist has 'no use' for Superman. And neither does Superboy! So there is a rift between Superman and Superboy ... AND THEY HAVEN'T EVEN MET YET!
In fact, the only thing Superboy has faith in is himself. Oooooh .... he's a loner and a tough guy!
Of course, as happens in comics, a super-villain attacks the city at the same time the two Titans are walking around.
The villain is Detritus, a sort of parasite. He seems to absorb any machine or person he comes in contact with, growing with the absorbed mass. When we first meet him, he is a towering giant.
Using his TK, Superboy strips Detritus down to his core. And here is the villain, bemoaning how it is hard for him to survive in a 'world met for others'. Detritus is lonely. So ... that makes it okay that he was ripping up the town, hurting people, and wanting to enslave them? Am I supposed to feel bad for him?
Superboy empathizes ... in a sad way it seems. And yet, can Superboy complain about being lonely when he, of his own accord, has set out on his own and pushed everyone away? Has not trusted anybody except himself?
Despite the damage and threats, Superboy is going to let this guy just leave!
Nothing to complain about the art here by RB Silva, pushing the edges of the panel and adding the gear motif. The art was great.
Detritus turns out to be a true villain though, spurning Superboy's sympathy and compassion and trying to absorb Kon instead.
So Superboy defeats him by punching him into the water because 'water and robots don't mix'. Not that Detritus was a robot (as far as I can tell). And not that that will end Detritus' threat. He'll just terrorize some other place when he regains consciousness. The bad guy, in essence, gets away!
As if everything in this issue wasn't bad enough, the issue ends on a terrible note. Bunker says they need to leave before the authorities arrive because the two will be blamed for the destruction, not praised for the rescue. Superboy now equates the hero experience with 'no credit and all of the blame'.
Is that what being a hero means these days in the DCnU? We certainly have seen that theme in all the super books. We have seen it in Legion Lost. It is a pervasive theme that is being overdone.
So what did we have in this issue.
Superboy robbing a bank.
Declaring himself a loner and then lamenting it.
Shunning Superman and showing how people either don't like Superman or are afraid of him.
Almost letting a super-villain walk away from devastation.
And then equating heroics with being blamed by the authorities.
It's terrible. It is terrible that this is what it means to be a super-hero in 2012.
It is terrible that the editors thought this was a good idea.
I don't want to hear that this is 'realistic'. Or that I am a curmudgeon or out of touch. This is a Superboy book ... not Mark Millar's Supercrooks, not Bomb Queen, not Irredeemable. Those books are already out there.
And I don't want to hear that this is what the readers want to read. Not all the time. I read Fatale and Bomb Queen and Wanted and Kick Ass. But not every comic on the rack needs to be a persecuted hero, painted with the same brush of alienation and isolation and angst.
Maybe ... maybe ... if DeFalco comes out and says that this petulant, self-centered, immature, and criminal Superboy is part of the journey. That he will learn some hard lessons and fly right soon. But this didn't feel like that. This felt like the future of this book and this character - a smug anti-hero, a quasi-supervillain.
I have read and reviewed every super-book on this blog for the last 3+ years. But I don't want to read this book if this is going to be the tone. I'll give it 3 more months to shape up or I'm out.
And it's a shame because I love RB Silva's art. But that alone can't keep me here.
Superboy robbed a bank and has no use for Superman. Yeesh.
Overall grade: F
I think you do need to give this book and the character a little more time. This is only the 11th issue and Superboy has started out as a blank slate and as can be expected with such heroes at this point, he's only taken a few steps in a long journey. I mean, in the pre-New 52, Superboy started out as a jerk and took a long time to mature and grow into the hero that he ended up as. At this point, Superboy is very young, and as Bunker said at some point in this issue, he has grown up in a test tube surrounded by villains who have only wanted to use him as a weapon. He has only been a hero for a little while and the only heroes that he has met so far have been misfit teenagers who are just as lost in his world as he is, and he has only met them recently. So he hasn't had much morality instilled into him so far and he doesn't know much about what it means to be a superhero. And Superboy has never met Superman and has heard little about him (so little that he doesn't seem to have come to the realization that Superman could be one of his "parents"), so how can you expect him to care much about the Man of Steel? If I were you, I would wait until the issue where Superboy has met Superman before deciding to quit this book.
ReplyDeleteHow can you read the book,but not understand it? You act like what you read is out of left field,when it was in lne with how this SB feels,and how his moral compass needs fine tuned,its been like this from the beginning.you have a nice big pretty blog,one that i visit everyday,you would think you could step outside your knee jerk reactions and actually try to understand things going on,but you didnt.i mean if you really believe what you wrote to be true,you really need to reevaluate your position as a reviewer,i mean anybody reading this superboys stories could figure out that he has issues knowing the difference between right and wrong,and he has issues with where his dna comes from,or that yeah in the new DCU heroes are not always celebrated,why are you acting like this is all a big shock to you.try to understand what you read,its about whats beyond the words,beyond the picture that makes a story.oh and also tattoos are not always to show how tough you are,lots of ppl put what they feel is important to them on their body,just like kon did here.I give your review a F.
ReplyDeletePRGirl1294 said:
ReplyDeleteAt this point, Superboy is very young, and as Bunker said at some point in this issue, he has grown up in a test tube surrounded by villains who have only wanted to use him as a weapon.
Tony said (posted his comment on SB 11 on a different post)
when it was in lne with how this SB feels,and how his moral compass needs fine tuned,its been like this from the beginning.
Thanks for the comments. If it is one thing I hope happens on this blog, it is dialogue and discussion. It is clear you liked this issue much more than I did.
I have to say I rarely unload on books like I did on this book, trying to see the best in every comic I read. But this one felt off for me.
I understand SB is young. But one thing that he has shown during the prior issues was still some compulsion to do what's right. Even in the earliest issues when he was in VR he was saving people. And I'd like to think that is the Superman in him fighting whatever the other genetic half of him is.
This was the first issue where I felt there was no conflict. He did stuff that was wrong without remorse. He said stuff that was wrong without thinking. It was the first issue that I haven't liked the character ... in fact I felt dislike for him. And so I panned the book.
I am not expecting him to come out as a finished product. I understand he is on the hero's journey. And I said I was going to give the book more issues to try to right what I felt was wrong here.
While I get this Superboy is still 'new', it's not a good sign when I'm 11 issues in and I still can't get myself to like this Superboy. In fact there are times I downright hate him in this run. I feel like I'm forcing myself to buy the book because of the title even thought it's been subpar in my eyes. Issue zero will probably be my last book. I really need to save the cash. This issue felt like a step back compared to last months book.
ReplyDeleteYour right he did have a sense of right and wrong.....about hurting ppl,or helping ppl,not things like we see in this issue.to him its a victimless crime.there will he tons of things that he cant comprehend as straight up bad,and he will get wrong,and thats part of his journey into being a real person.you said he was young,i would say,he isnt young as he is brand spankin new to being alive all together.
ReplyDeleteI understand you want your S wearers to be heroes through and through,but kon isnt even a real person through and through yet,im sure he will get there someday,but you cant expect it to happen so soon,its just not possible.
That S might have originated with superman,but that S is his too,no matter how he got it,it was his at birth,and thats all he knows.
If your not willing to see what the writer is trying to convey,then why would you buy the book?
ReplyDeleteBecause the writer is leaving the book and it's a writers job to grab me earlier on in the first couple of issues. I keep waiting for it to turn around but after 11 issues of people telling me to wait, I've just had enough.
ReplyDeleteThe premise for this superboy has been apparent since the very first issue,maybe this isnt the book for you,cause besides the crossover issues,this book has been good,on point,and moving forward.
ReplyDeleteDifferent strokes for different folks.
Moving forward? I dunno about that. It's been pretty inconsistent at best. But yeah, it's not my cup of tea. I'm pretty much done with it for now which sucks because I've read the character since '93.
ReplyDeletePersonally, I thought you made excellent points about what is wrong with the DCnU, using the Superboy series as the example.
ReplyDeleteThe social darkness, the amoral/dark morality of the DCnUniverse, where too many heroes are viewed with so much fear. Why should or would they want to become or remain a hero with this much persecution, fear and loathing in this DC 52 universe?
I really want to read about super heroes and heroines who have hope, enjoy a good portion of their "lives", going through a series of trials/adventures, learning about themselves, their own personal strengths and weaknesses and of other people and their world around them. Put them through the wringer, survive, deal with the consequences, the good and bad of it. All while the next event or adventure is about to pop out over the horizon.
Thanks for the great discussion. I have really enjoyed reading everyone's take on the book and the character.
ReplyDeleteI appreciate your passion for the direction of this issue Tony. And you're right, maybe this book isn't for me. Maybe everyone else is going to applaud this issue.
But remember I have been pretty pleased with this book up to now. I haven't bashed it before. I didn't mind seeing this Superboy struggle with what is right and wrong because he usually defaulted to right.
I really felt like this issue was a step backwards for the character. He hasn't acted like a criminal before. Robbing a bank of millions isn't a victimless crime. Trusting only yourself and shutting out everyone else isn't what he has wanted in the first 10 issues.
And maybe it was that perceived coarsening of his personality that let me down so much.
I will stick around, at least through Superboy #0 and the super-crossover. And I'll hope that someone will help him understand this world better.
Haven't commented in a long time,but,it's kinda sad when the comment involves calling out the DC editors and perhaps DeFalco for outright making SB do a 180 and start being a douche.
ReplyDeleteThe barcode tatoo,which SB had during the promotions,is kind of disappointing.It would be much better if it was some sort of lab brand and SB wore it to remember that while being a clone of the world's mightiest hero,he's also the dream of the human's integratong with that hero.
One thing I'd like to point out is that,I don't think Lodbell is responsible for this akward change.So far,for 10 issues of SB and Teen Titans along with an annual,he showed that he can do the whole "hero's journey" and especially the "young hero's journey",always with the rash new hero and a more seasoned one,the latter often acting as the voice of logic.
So,this issue seems totally out of it's waters,like the series is rebooted after barelly 10 issues.
Anj said..
ReplyDelete"I really felt like this issue was a step backwards for the character. He hasn't acted like a criminal before."
Remember that scene in issue #4 when he burned down that Christmas tree? Didn't that seem criminal to you? As for robbing a bank being a victimless crime, Tony said that to Superboy, it's a victimless crime. He meant that Superboy doesn't yet understand that it's not a victimless crime because he's only a few months old and has only truly been in the hero business for a few weeks. Obviously, you do need to wait until the Super-family crossover because all this issue proves is that Superboy is very misguided and needs Superman.
ok let me get this out for all you who keep saying you read superboy,HE ISNT A HERO,atleast not yet.he has in every book that he has appeared in pretty much knocked you over the head with that,so why are you all complaining like its something new now.reread every issue he has been in,he says atleast one thing that shows you that he doesnt think like a hero...go ahead ill wait.
ReplyDeletehe doesnt want to hurt anyone,and he will stop people from being hurt,thats extremely basic human morality there,thats as far as he has come.yes he now is a part of the titans,but thats more because they saved him,and because he knows he can learn from them.
I'll really sound stupid but what the hey.
ReplyDelete@tony : Thing is,even if he doesn't think of himself as a hero,he has been exposed over the past months to a lot of things and the past 10 issues have shown even if he is kind of a loner,he isn't the douchebag gritt-machine he is now.It's like if I woke up in the middle of the night and randomly pulled looted my local bank for giggles and saying "it's a victimless crime,no-one's hurt".
If he did that in the VR world or if he hadn't gone through all he went and someone told him "hey kid,you need money to live...so,uh...why don't you crack open that bank to help ourselves.If no-one get's hurt,nothing bad will happen".
@PRGirl : Unless it's Vatican,then it's considered a crime to burn down a cristmass tree.If I would to put some things in SB's crimes list those would be : "attempted murder" for assaulting the two mutants and "assault against privates" for trying to free Caitlyn.But they were justified and SB knew that justice was on his side,even if the law wasn't.And he wouldn't be able to pull it off if N.O.W.H.E.R.E. thought he was usefull.
just because you cant understand this superboy,doesnt mean he is a douchbag.he has been written consistent from the start,you just let yourself believe he was a certain way because he can smile,joke,have a lil fun,that doesnt mean he knows right from wrong,not to mention,whos to say he cares about that anyway,he could think if he isnt hurting someone directly then its not bad.
ReplyDeletehe has been written consistent from the start,you just let yourself believe he was a certain way because he can smile,joke,have a lil fun,that doesnt mean he knows right from wrong
ReplyDeleteWell, I think we just need to agree to disagree here.
Robbing a bank isn't a little fun. Where does it end if hurting someone is the threshold?
Let's say he decided he wanted a car, researched and found out that cars are at car dealerships, and then stole one. Is that okay? Is that a victimless crime? After all, no one got hurt?
What's worse is there isn't anyone in Superboy's life now to help him figure out right from wrong. He has decided to go it alone, trusting only himself.
And you might think this issue was consistent with others, but I don't and clearly others didn't as well.
I will see if things take a better turn, at least through the super-crossover.
never said it was ok for him to do it,im just saying its inside the way he thinks for it to happen,and yes,i do believe he "might" steal a car,course just bunker getting on him about robbing a bank will get it burned into his brain that its wrong,even if he doesnt get it completley that its wrong.
ReplyDeletehey and remember last issue of teen titans tim said he knows kon SB would do the same for him,and SB said that he knew that isnt true,and this issue he was willing to runaway with the ppl,away from deitrus,even let the big robot dude go,before he said that he was gonna consume ppl,which is where kon knows better,and was ready to put him down.im making perfect sense here.
U
i know this SB is straddling the line way to much for you,but thats exactly what he is supposed to be doing now,you are supposed to think he might turn bad,like his creator harvest,or his "maybe" dna donor
lex luthor,he isnt supposed to be squeeky clean,i mean just look at the first page of thr issue,he totally looks like lex there,with power to spare.
ReplyDeleteThanks for writing this post, Anj, it needs to see said. The new DC is trying so hard to be edgy that it's forgetting that at base, characters who wear the S must be heroes. This isn't Grifter, or Voodoo, Deathstroke, or any of the other zcx Nineties throwbacks - it's a character named Superboy. Yes, he can be the naive clone, but his most basic instinct should be to do the right thing.
ReplyDeleteThere is no ambiguity in what Superboy has done - look at how he tells Bunker that he waited until nighttime to break into the bank and make off with what looks like millions. He knows what 'borrow' means. Anyone see a note? Security? Nope, the kid's a bank robber - the only thing I want to see Superman do when he shows up is give him a stiff talking to and persuade him to make restitution. Really, he should be doing time.
Even if we accept that Superboy has gotten a bit stupider than in previous issues, the second Bunker learned what he'd done, the story should have focussed on Superboy's skewed morality/contempt for people without powers. Why is the thoroughly decent Miguel going along with Superboy?
it's a character named Superboy. Yes, he can be the naive clone, but his most basic instinct should be to do the right thing.
ReplyDeleteThanks for the support Mart!
I think it is time for a new editor. One who understands that basic tone of super-books.
It´s understandable why you didn´t like the issue, it wasn´t my favourite either.
ReplyDeleteBut I wanted to share my two cents and what I perceive about this Superboy. :)
From what I´ve been reading, I have the feeling that while he is a powerful teenager, fated to become someday a Superman...emotionally, he´s a child (and his maturity might be from a 6 to an 8 years old)and he´s still at the "I want, I need so I will get" phase, without considering the full consequences.
I was told that everybody has a little angel and a little demon by their sides, telling what to do...Superboy has a little Superman and a little Lex Luthor... if in this New 52 part of his DNA still belongs to Lex Luthor....I think that the Lex side instigated Kon into "borrowing" money from the bank. (I bet that Lex would so do this!:>)
Bunker could had been more asertive about the "borrowing" issue, but I think he´s trying to be cautious. He doesn´t fully know Superboy, and he wanted to avoid a possible fight. He wants Superboy to trust him first and in a subtle way, he´s pointing him what´s good and what´s wrong. After I read the last page I had the feeling that Bunker in a certain way succeeded, and Superboy will fix his wrongdoing and return the money.
emotionally, he´s a child (and his maturity might be from a 6 to an 8 years old)and he´s still at the "I want, I need so I will get" phase, without considering the full consequences.
ReplyDeleteThanks for the comment. This has been such a great discussion.
I understand that SB isn't quite there emotionally. But I think he understood some consequences given that he went out of his way to hide that he did this. I suppose this scene might have a completely different feeling to it if he walked in during the daylight and took the money while police surrounded the bank. Maybe some other hero would arrive to tell him that it is wrong and help him realize that.
But he snuck in, under the cover of night, disabling alarms. He knew on some level this was wrong.
We'll see where this ends up.
One question related to another aspect of the issue - the woman from the coffee shop isn't going to be nobody, this being comics. Who do we reckon? I'd like Nastalthia Luthor, please!
ReplyDeleteAyhe you made a good point,i think others on here are looking over your two points because of two things,he has a S on his chest,and he has been making strides in some ways.
ReplyDeleteI would love for his landlord to be either powergirl or the contessa.
Did anybody else wince at Bunker's line: "In my opinion, and it isn't a popular one, that man (meaning Superman) is the greatest hero that ever lived,"?
ReplyDeleteWhat is up with DC making Superman so much less of a beloved hero than he should be? He's either a compete cypher in the DCnU, or he makes the masses uncomfortable. I mean, THIS is what DC's plan was for him. They had a chance to start from scratch, and THIS is the direction they chose as THE bear option? Wow. It shows me just how screwed up a view DC (probably Didio at the head) has on Superman. I really hope Man of Steel finally makes Superman matter again.
P.S. Another line that bothered me, from the Jusice League, was when Hal Jordan says to Superman, "Trust you? I don't even know you. All you ever do is float there behind us and barely say a word." Again, really? This is how Superman is seen by his own teammate? FIVE years in? If he can't even make an impact on his own team, then how can he have a hope of doing so on the world?
I really find myself caring less and less about this new DC universe. There's a large part of me that just doesn't care anymore. But getting myself to just cut myself off isn't easy. But it's sure getting closer to that point. As long as guys like Didio, Johns, and Lee are in charge, I just don't think I can trust the direction of these books any longer. It's such a shame. :(
Yup, I hated that line too, not only for its content, but for its clunkiness.
DeleteAnd I'm with you on the way the JL DON'T work together too, I think I mentioned that scene in my blog review of the issue.
That JLA scene irked me enough I posted about it here. Superman shouldn't be acing like that or reacted to like that.
ReplyDeleteAnd Bunker's line was pretty horrid. If this was Lobdell's plot and he is writing Superman, maybe I should be a little more worried.
Tiny: thanks! And I too hope the tenant would be Powergirl or the contessa. Especially Powergirl! :D
ReplyDelete*edit* Tony.
ReplyDeleteSorry for the wrong spelling of your name! D:
If I remember the SDCC transcripts right in either the JLA Annual #1 or the #0 issue.
ReplyDeleteAquaman calls the JLA out about how the group really isn't a group and no one really trusts each other.
I wonder what is going on behind the scenes/
Not gonna lie I think you're a little harsh here. What I'm hoping is that Kon screws up really badly until the point that he pays for it and learn his lessons. He have no sense of right and wrong and I think its up to Kal to have to teach him what is right and wrong.
ReplyDeleteI love Kon and I am open to this interpretation of him. I thought that the issue was great but was a little startled myself that he would rob a bank. The only thing that went through my mind was "I hope Superman fans wont get too upset about this". But apparently I think it did.
I do hope to see Kon complet his hero's journey soon and I can't wait to see that day come. But it just makes looking forward to that day even better.
You know, if Aquaman calls out the Justice League for not trusting one another, he could maybe lead a new League, in which members commit fully to the team, live and train together, move to Detroit, breakdance ...
ReplyDelete@Martin
ReplyDeleteThe #0 cover heavily implies (to me) a division of the JLA might be happening perhaps all the heroes surrounding Aquaman on the cover is a clue?
@Valerie Maybe I'm being thick(er than usual, even) as the only JL #0 issue cover I can find online shows a rather mean looking Captain Marvel/Shazam ...
ReplyDeleteEven I doubt that DC will do something as radical as breaking up the JL before the team has even been estabilished. Although a new Detroit version JL would be bizarre enough to warrant purchasing.
ReplyDeleteAs for my being rough on this issue, I will again say I hope that this will be a lesson learned and things will improve over time. But I never thought I would need to allow myself time for a hero to realize robbing a bank was wrong. It even sounds weird typing it.
@martin
ReplyDeleteMaybe I am thinking of the wrong issue or maybe it's a variant cover?
I will check into it some more.
@anj with JLI cancelled maybe DC is hoping to replace it with another JL type team series?
That was your first mistake anj believing kon to be a hero,cause he isnt,far from it.if you take off the hero rosey glasses while seeing him,and see him as a brand new person,who was created by someone evil,with possible partial evil dna in him,you will get how he thinks a little bit better.
ReplyDeleteOh and you guys are projecting your issues with the new 52 onto SB,he has nothing to do with the perception of heroes in the DCU now,he is his own person,in a unique situation.
Tony, do you mean to sound quite so confrontational? Anj does a great job of making this a welcoming place, disagreement is fine but you're constantly sounding bad-tempered.
ReplyDeleteNo,not confrontational,more defensive i guess.sorry if i come with fire and brimstone,i just feel anj is not understanding kon and what they are trying to do with his morality journey.
ReplyDeleteIm sorry anj.
Oh and martin your blog is a frequent stop for me also.
Cheers Tony! Hope I didn't come across too much as Elderly Teacher!
ReplyDeleteI'm so keen to see what happens when Superboy meets Superman.
I know you dont review it on your blog,but you should,just for me lol.
ReplyDeleteNo,not confrontational,more defensive i guess.sorry if i come with fire and brimstone,i just feel anj is not understanding kon and what they are trying to do with his morality journey.
ReplyDeleteWell, I don't mind your passion about Superboy. It reminds me of my passion for Supergirl.
But I have commented on his journey in the reviews of issues 1 through 10. And I liked he was conflicted and trying to figure things out.
This issue just felt horribly wrong to me. Hopefully it is a speed bump and not something permanent.
So if say he met lex and fell under his wing you woukdnt like it? Cause it could possibly happen,they already think and act a lot like each other.
ReplyDeleteOh and how do you feel about him not wanting to "save the day" like he has been shown not to want to do more than once now?
Oh and hiw do you feel about him trying to understand the bad guy,and almost sympathizing with them?
What a great analogy for DC. DC robs people blind because they have power and doesn't care at all. They need to quit making comics if they're not going to be brutally honest about their jobs, and give some love to the fans.
ReplyDeleteClearly, DC new 52 makes me sick to my stomach, for what they have done to my favorite DC characters and the stuff they have added and making it into something it isn't. It's not getting new readers. I now know why.
This new 52 is so alienating and messed up in so many ways, it's not even funny at all.
At this point, I actually miss the real DC universe!!!